Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+ Retro-fitting A Turbo, Will this work?

[Thread Reaper]

My roommate and I are currently working on a 97 Pontiac Sunfire. It's a 2.2L 4 cylinder with a 5 speed manual. We want to turbocharge it, but we're on a pretty tight budget.

To get to the point, there's a 2.2L 4 cylinder Dodgge Daytona in a local junkyard with a stock turbocharger. The guy offered to sell me the whole motor (which runs) for $150. I'm not really interested in the motor, but I might be interested in the turbo if we could retrofit it to the Sunfire. Since the displacement of the two motors is the same, I'm assuming that the turbo should be a good size.

There is a shop here in town that has done a lot of exhaust fabrication for us in the past. It should be no problem for him to fit the wastegate into the Sunfire's exhaust and plumb it back to the turbine. The turbo is non-intercooled right now, and we want to add and intercooler, and it's an old type of turbo that Chrysler used to use that doesn't need a blowoff valve. I'm not sure exactly how it prevents backpressure from getting back to the compressor, but from everything I've read and been told, a BOV isn't required.

So, my question is, is this project really going to be as simple as fitting the Daytona's turbo in the exhaust and intake of our Sunfire motor, or are there other issues I haven't thought of? In short, is this going to work? I know it's not going to be the biggest, baddest turbo we can get for this motor, but if it will work properly and give us some boost until we can get the cash to do a full custom setup, we really can't go wrong for $150, right?

[97SilverGS-T]

Considering that your sunfire was not built with forged internals, the amount of time and money spent to JUST GET BY would in my opinion be pointless. You'd only be able to run like 2-4 psi MAYBE 5 but thats pushing it. On top of that, you'd need a custom manifold, you'd need to get the turbo rebuilt which is $300 at least for a full rebuild. Not to mention all the other bits n pieces you'd need like gaskets to match the O2 to the DP, the oil feed line, oil return line, tapping your oil pan without cracking it, then getting custom mandrel bends for your IC piping to fit properly and a mounting spot for you IC...SO much more than just bolting it on to your manifold. I'd advise against it, but if having the 3psi is worth it to you, then go for it! Trust me on turboing an NT vehicle, I also have an RS eclipse that me and my dad turbocharged and it was NOT easy.

Good luck let us know how it goes

[Thread Reaper]

Okay, I wasn't thinking about getting oil to the turbo, thanks for pointing that out. As for the forged internals and the custom manifold, tapping the oilpain, etc, are these issues that come up with aftermarket "bolt-on" turbo kits? Most of these are advertised as "just bolt on and go."

I've been around cars and performance motors since I was very young, but most of my dealings are in the drag racing scene where powerplants are huge pieces of detroit iron and blowers are the way to go. So I've never actually attempted to tackle installing a turbo.

If I'm not mistaken, you're basically talking about rebuilding the motor to get it ready for the turbo. That's nothing that we can't handle, but probably more work than we're looking to do to this car (for now).

Thanks for the reply, I'll check back to see if anyone comes up with anything else I hadn't thought about. At this time, I'm still thinking about attempting this project.

[97SilverGS-T]

Okay, I wasn't thinking about getting oil to the turbo, thanks for pointing that out.  As for the forged internals and the custom manifold, tapping the oilpain, etc, are these issues that come up with aftermarket "bolt-on" turbo kits?  Most of these are advertised as "just bolt on and go."

yea, companies never want to point out the details, the down and dirty, the nit and gritty, the elbow grease you must apply...they like to advertise just bolting on power and not the wrench time behind it...DONT BE FOOLED MY YOUNG ONE!!

[396Velle]

i would just get the motor from the junkyard and see if its any good, and if itll work just go with it since its already built to have a turbo on it.

[97SilverGS-T]

um, trying to do a complete motor swap into a sunfire wouldnt be ideal. Just because they are the same displacement doesnt mean it will be a direct fit. What about the tranny? what about motor mounts? what about ECU wiring? what if its coming off a RWD car, a sunfire is FWD....again, FINE PRINT is a bitch...you'd be better off doing the turbo swap instead of a complete MOTOR swap...if you are that worried about blowing your motor, then at least upgrade to forged internals.

[396Velle]

yea i didnt think about the whole FWD RWD thing, or the wiring harnesses...those are a bitch

[Thread Reaper]

i would just get the motor from the junkyard and see if its any good, and if itll work just go with it since its already built to have a turbo on it.

Yeah, doing a motor swap on these cars would be more trouble than it's worth, and sort of defeat the purpose. I mean, after the swap, you'd still have the same size motor, you'd just have spent weeks beating your head against the wall trying to swap them. As 97SilverGS-T said it makes much more sense to just build this motor for the turbo. We'd like to eventually go to a full custom turbo setup anyway. As if going from a Dodge to a Pontiac wasn't hard enough, the Daytona is an automatic, the Pontiac is a 5 speed, so we'd be having to lose the torque convertor and mate up a workable clutch, not something I want to deal with.

I have another question, does the turbo have it's own oil pump, or is there a seperate oil pump I need to have for it? In other words, do I just need to run the send/return lines into it? Oh, and what gaskets are you talking about to match the O2 to the DP? I'm assuming by O2 you mean the sensor, what is a DP?

[sickgrin]

You'd only be able to run like 2-4 psi MAYBE 5 but thats pushing it.

You're being a bit of an alarmist here... Most factory boosted applications do not run forged internals. The biggest limiting factor will be his compression ratio.

Reaper, assuming your CR is reasonable, and there aren't any glaring flaws in that particular engine design ~7 psi shouldn't be much of a problem. If CR is relatively low (high 8's to low 9's) 10-12 psi should be attainable with the proper head gasket and tuning. Some stout engines with compression in the 8's can handle over 15 psi on cast internals running pump gas.

Detonation kills most boosted engines, not necessarily higher boost levels. Forged internals give you more of a safety net. To save yourself a lot of time and trouble, I would suggest investing in a wideband O2 sensor to do your tuning. If you're really looking to push your luck with boost, use a J&S unit.

I suggest doing some research on the engine itself, also see if you can find anyone else who has done the same sort of thing. If engine is good and CR is reasonable, I suggest buying a Kenne Bell Boost-A-Pump and a wideband O2. Start with the waste gate set as low as possible and move upwards from there.

You may also want to check out the JYTurbo yahoo mailing list. Most of the guys on there are old and cranky, but they have more knowledge on turbos than you can imagine.

I have another question, does the turbo have it's own oil pump, or is there a seperate oil pump I need to have for it?

You usually tee off the where the oil sender is installed. Ive seen a few setups that use an adapter behind the oil filter.

[Thread Reaper]

Thank you, sickgrin, your reply is most informative. I'll look into that mailing list you suggested, and I'll also post back here with some specs on the engine to see what other information you guys might be able to offer.